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Least favorite episodes and TV boyfriends

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It's almost half past eight here (I swear that everytime I have to write/tell the hour in English I need to read again the rules. I can't seem to be able to learn them) and it's meme time! But first let me rant about television boyfriends and how it hurts to lose them



FUCK. Fuckfuckfuck. They killed off Will Gardner!

I can't believe it. I'm in denial forever. I loved Will Gardner, he was one of my favorite male characters in tv. I almost love all the characters in The Good Wife, but Will was also the lead man and I can't believe that he won't appear anymore. Plus I'm shocked by the King's choice to just kill him. I understand that Josh Charles, the actor, didn't want to play Will anymore biI guess there were other choices to make him disappear. But they killed him off and in a bloody way.

I almost feel betrayed. Because The Good Wife was all about political scandals and badass lawyers and, generally, a woman's life. I didn't expect a violent death from this show, especially considering that Will was also a protagonist.

Another TV boyfriend is gone after the Eleven Doctor. It kinda sucks.

Important thing: I cheated. I accidentally read a spoiler about Will's death and I watched the episode, but I'm still at the beginning of season 4. I know, it was stupid but once I read the news I couldn't help myself to not watch it. I already had a feeling about Alicia getting her own law firm so I'm not shocked. I know I ruined some surprises but I had to watch the scene. Generally, please don't write spoilers about S4/S5. I know it doesn't seem to make sense but still.

WILL, NO >O<


And back with the scheduled meme

Day 1: Favorite Season
Day 2: Favorite Episode
Day 3: Favorite Song Used In An Episode
Day 4: Favorite Female Character
Day 5: Least Favorite Female Character
Day 6: Favorite Male Character
Day 7: Least Favorite Male Character
Day 8: Favorite Friendship
Day 9: Favorite Romance
Day 10: Least Favorite Season
Day 11: Least Favorite Romance
Day 12: Least Favorite Episode
Day 13: Favorite Potential Slayer
Day 14: Favorite Female Villain
Day 15: Favorite Male Villain
Day 16: Episode You Like That Everyone Else Hates
Day 17: Character You Relate To The Most
Day 18: Character Who Didn’t Get Enough Screen Time
Day 19: Character You Like That Everyone Else Hates
Day 20: Best Spike-centric Episode
Day 21: Best Willow-centric Episode
Day 22: Best Xander-centric Episode
Day 23: Two Characters You Wanted To Get Together That Never Did
Day 24: Hottest scene
Day 25: Favorite Buffyverse Saying
Day 26: Favorite Scooby Moment
Day 27: Cutest Moment
Day 28: Character You Love To Hate
Day 29: Episode You Hate That Everyone Else Loves
Day 30: What You Think Made Buffy So Great



I don't have a lot of least favorite episodes unlike the list of favorite ones. I love almost every episode of the show, even things like Beer Bad (I will get there). I have episodes I don't love like the others, for example I think that the second part of S7 is less interesting and beautiful than the first part and so some Initiative-centric episodes. I also don't laugh at Storyteller's Andrew. Technically it's a good episode with an interesting plot and many good ideas but I don't laugh at the jokes (Expect, maybe, the initial one with Anya)

So, if I have to choose my very least favourite episodes, they will be mostly two:

Goodbye Iowa because boring. The first couple of times I saw the episode I couldn't finish it. I was so bored by Riley's struggle. Which technically was even interesting and the scene at Willy's was provoking, but I guess that I don't really empathize with a white male super-soldier wants-to-be-hero-guy. I will give another chance to the episode eventually, but I'm not that involved in the Initiative - hence Riley's - storyline.

The puppet show Worst episode ever maybe? I didn't really rewatch it. The puppet little guy is SO CREEPY. Do not want.









Comments

( 35 comments — Leave a comment )
teragramm
Mar. 26th, 2014 12:51 pm (UTC)
The puppet show Worst episode ever maybe? I didn't really rewatch it. The puppet little guy is SO CREEPY. Do not want. Oh, I like the puppet show. Mind you, it would never make one of my top ten shows list but I do enjoy it and partly because the little puppet guy is so creepy.
kikimay
Mar. 26th, 2014 01:26 pm (UTC)
I like the final scene with Buffy, Xander and Willow playing at the theatre but the little guy is just too creepy (Okay, the Gentlemen are even creepier but Hush is awesome)
itsnotmymind
Mar. 26th, 2014 01:46 pm (UTC)
I actually like Goodbye, Iowa. Riley's storyline in S4 interested me. I'm aware I'm in the minority on that one.
kikimay
Mar. 26th, 2014 07:55 pm (UTC)
On the paper is interesting for me too: the soldier who lose his way and learn how to "decide". It's a fascinating subject, but the episode in question doesn't do much for me.
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 27th, 2014 02:03 am (UTC)
Huh, I've never thought of the puppet guy as creepy. So you've never seen Xander joking around with it? "Redrum! Redrum!" or "Hello, I am completely inanimate." And now I'm laughing. To me that's funny.
kikimay
Mar. 27th, 2014 08:54 am (UTC)
I rewatched once, maybe. I don't recall the scenes but I remember that I thought that the little steps where creepy.
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 27th, 2014 12:55 pm (UTC)
When Buffy was trapped under whatever it was that fell from the ceiling? Those were definitely meant to be creepy.

The thing for me could be that the first time I saw Buffy was shortly after my mother had passed away. I was pretty numb, and anytime since then when I've rewatched it I knew what to expect and so wouldn't have been creeped out.
kikimay
Mar. 27th, 2014 01:43 pm (UTC)
You make me want to rewatch the episode. Maybe I will like it more.

Also I'm sorry about your mother. I didn't know and I know it sounds stupid after a while to say sorry, but I hope you can accept my words.
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 27th, 2014 07:30 pm (UTC)
Thank you for your condolences. I appreciate them.

Mom passed way back in 2008 but that kind of emotional wound never really goes away. It has been fresher than usual recently for no apparently obvious reason.
kikimay
Mar. 27th, 2014 07:37 pm (UTC)
I'm truly sorry. *hugs*
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 27th, 2014 11:54 pm (UTC)
Thanks. *hugs back*
red_satin_doll
Mar. 27th, 2014 01:44 pm (UTC)
So you've never seen Xander joking around with it? "Redrum! Redrum!" or "Hello, I am completely inanimate." And now I'm laughing.

Oh god that was funny. And there's the series long thread of "Buffy has an intuition that something is wrong but no one initially believes her"; the relationship with "created people" (Adam, Buffybot etc), as well as souls being stuffed into a "body"; the closing credits Oedipus bit; Snyder's introduction to the series and his comments; first use of "wigging out" (freaking out) in the series.

I actually got teary-eyed when Buffy folded Sid's arms after he "died", one warrior paying respect to the sacrifice of another (see: Chosen). There's Sid's creepiness and how she pushes him off in contrast to S6;

and best of all! Giles trying to be the stage manager and nearly getting his head sliced open is played out again in Restless in both his and Willow's dreams.

That's what I love about this series that even the throwaway eps have something in them that connect them to the whole.
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 27th, 2014 07:26 pm (UTC)
I adore Giles in Willow's dream. That was hilarious. The Oedipus bit was great too.
red_satin_doll
Mar. 28th, 2014 10:26 pm (UTC)
Restless is one of the best Harmony moments evah - never fails to make me smile just thinking of Giles' annoyed reaction to her trying to bite him.
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 29th, 2014 12:49 am (UTC)
That is a good bit.
frelling_tralk
Mar. 27th, 2014 01:07 pm (UTC)
Goodbye Iowa was very boring, but my least favourite has to be Where The Wild Things Are with the entire episode of Buffy/Riley sex *g*
kikimay
Mar. 27th, 2014 01:46 pm (UTC)
Surprisingly (Or not, I don't know) I like Where The Wild Things Are. It's an example of interesting Xander/Anya interaction and I love when they face together the haunted house. Plus I think it has some really funny moments and I don't mind the whole Buffy/Riley's infinite sex scene.
dragonyphoenix
Mar. 27th, 2014 07:32 pm (UTC)
Ugh. Where the Wild Things Are? Yeah, that episode was 45 minutes of my life I'll never get back.
mcjulie
Mar. 28th, 2014 01:45 am (UTC)
Yeah, WTWTA is my choice for least favorite episode. There's something so weirdly and viscerally unpleasant about an episode where Buffy and Riley are having sex the whole time -- that, and I think the monster concept is weird and vague, the metaphor doesn't work, and the plot is kinda dull.

But mostly it's the Buffy/Riley sex that does it.
red_satin_doll
Mar. 27th, 2014 01:53 pm (UTC)
But they killed him off and in a bloody way.

On the upside, at least they don't just do that to female characters so I feel - better?

I hate when they do that when an actor is leaving, kill the character or destroy them in a way that they cannot possibly return. I'm thinking of what they did to Zack Addy in Bones. TOTALLY unnecessary, completely destroyed his character. I had no idea how much I loved him until they did what they did in season 3 to write him off the show. Ugh. It didn't even further anybody's development or serve a purpose as far as I can tell.

They did kill off a minor character on the show but he was a minor reocurring character so no great love there and they did it in a way that was really well done (unusually so for Bones by that time.) Although the death was really just a pretext to get two other characters in bed so...we're kind of back to square one, aren't we?

I love almost every episode of the show, even things like Beer Bad (I will get there).

Beer Bad is SO CUTE! Cave Buffy (who incidentally foreshadows both the First Slayer and a disoriented Resurrected Buffy in Bargaining wandering around SD when everything is on fire); Parker getting a smack-down from Willow and Cave Buffy; the humor...everything except the cave guys really.

But then again I don't get the I Robot You Jane hate.
kikimay
Mar. 27th, 2014 02:04 pm (UTC)

On the upside, at least they don't just do that to female characters so I feel - better?


You already read the major spoiler! D:

LOL. I hope it doesn't ruin the series for you. I have complex emotions about Will's death which are mostly: FUCK NO! WHY? It's a subversion of the classic fridged woman trope. This time the Kings want to show us a male character's death that fuels the female's plot and I have a couple of ideas on how. Generally it's an incredibly well written show and it does a great job with equality between male and female characters.

Still I loved Will Gardner. He was such an interesting and fascinating man and his death feels so wrong on The Good Wife (which is mostly about political scandals and Alicia's professional and private life) I have to process the whole thing. For now I'm just WILL NO! BRING HIM BACK.

Beer Bad also feautures a funny Xander (I don't always find him funny, but I like his storyarc in S4) plus you know the scene when Giles is trying to describe cave!Buffy to a student? LAUGHS. Everytime. :)
red_satin_doll
Mar. 27th, 2014 02:50 pm (UTC)
You already read the major spoiler!

What can I say? Also, I'd suggest putting the major spoilers after the meme part, so I can read the meme and skip the spoilers rather than going past the spoiler to get to the meme? So I won't be so tempted.

But I didn't read too carefully and don't know what episode so there's still that. I knew ten years ago about Tara's death but it still hurts so much - I didn't know when or how. Then when I started watching the show I heard that Joyce and Anya died but not the specifics in all three cases I was constantly on the edge of my seat. I was absolutely convinced that Joyce was going to die in S1. Then by S5 I was kind of lulled into forgetfulness because I loved her increased presence so much even with the cancer story like BIG RED FLAG.

I'm sorry you lost a beloved character, sweetie. It's amazing how much that can hurt. I'm grieving for Tara more two years later if that's possible.
kikimay
Mar. 27th, 2014 07:43 pm (UTC)
The bad thing is that once you open the topic it shows you everything even if the arguments are separated. Well, I hope you would enjoy the show anyway.

(There is also this love-triangle between Alicia, her husband Peter and Will, but I really like how they managed to do it and I'm sure you will too because it's not about wrong/right man and Alicia is in control. I was totally team Will, even if I didn't ship anything in the show, but I really liked him as a character. Well, life goes on. If Josh Charles decided that he wanted to do something else we have to respect his choice.)
red_satin_doll
Mar. 28th, 2014 01:17 pm (UTC)
The bad thing is that once you open the topic it shows you everything even if the arguments are separated.

For some reason when I want my posts to be behind "the cut" for length, I have to use the "spoiler" function because "cut" won't work for me. But I then can't put any spoilers within the larger spoiler (so far - there has to be a way to get around that.) I've seen folks who set up mulitple spoilers within their posts and SOME DAY I will master this stuff. Really.

but I really like how they managed to do it and I'm sure you will too because it's not about wrong/right man

Now I am intrigued!

If Josh Charles decided that he wanted to do something else we have to respect his choice.

Oh absolutely! But the two things - the actor leaving and the character being killed - are two separate things to my mind. They HAD to find a way to write Will off as a regular character; they DIDN'T have to kill him. In most instances it's for the emotional impact, the gotcha or whatnot; and I'm not sure if Joss hasn't been an influence in that becoming normalized on tv. I don't know.

kikimay
Mar. 28th, 2014 01:48 pm (UTC)
I've seen folks who set up mulitple spoilers within their posts and SOME DAY I will master this stuff. Really.

I know nothing about LJ techniques. >O<

Oh absolutely! But the two things - the actor leaving and the character being killed - are two separate things to my mind. They HAD to find a way to write Will off as a regular character; they DIDN'T have to kill him. In most instances it's for the emotional impact, the gotcha or whatnot; and I'm not sure if Joss hasn't been an influence in that becoming normalized on tv. I don't know.


I agree and that's the reason why I thought that Will's death was unnecessary and off with the show. Still the writing is good and I have to give them a chance. They also wrote a letter to the fans explaining their choice (Which is something that Joss would never. Except at the end of S8) and they seem very considerate with the fandom. Let's see what happens next. I will elaborate their choice understanding the consequences.
red_satin_doll
Mar. 28th, 2014 02:14 pm (UTC)
Well Joss "explained" his choice about Tara back in the day, and he literally said "It was more painful for me than it was for you". I read that two years ago and thought "OH YOU DID NOT GO THERE."
kikimay
Mar. 28th, 2014 02:30 pm (UTC)
LOL.

But I still love Joss. Even with all his flaws, I like too much his writing. I wish I could be able to create a world in which so many people invested so many emotions.
red_satin_doll
Mar. 28th, 2014 10:23 pm (UTC)
I actually do respect him for what he gets right, and for what he accomplished. I just - ugh - I can't say I "love" him. But again, I've been through that "worship" phase with another "Creative genius" who is amazing and talented but flawed and human.

When we place other human beings above us as "godlike" it does them and us no good.

mcjulie
Mar. 28th, 2014 01:54 am (UTC)
I am a Beer Bad defender. I think it falls apart a bit in the final act, but the first half is sooooo funny.

And the writers get mad props for the dude dialog during that first beer-sharing scene (before everybody starts going all 1 million BC) -- they pegged EXACTLY the kind of pseudo-intellectual things college boys say when they're trying to impress college girls, that doesn't make any sense, but fails to make sense in such a way that the college girls (especially if they are insecure freshmen) worry that maybe it's them -- maybe it's over their heads -- maybe they're not smart enough for college.

HAHAHAHA.

Anyway, I love that scene.
kikimay
Mar. 28th, 2014 12:47 pm (UTC)
I love Beer Bad too. The dialogue pseudo-intellectual college boy VS Xander is gold and I love the whole Willow VS Parker smackdown.
red_satin_doll
Mar. 28th, 2014 01:37 pm (UTC)
I always kind of liked it that the one time (aside from the Zeppo and Him) that Xander is the "detective" the one sussing out the bad guy, the guy just walks away because all Xander can do is say "You're a very bad man!" He's not the slayer, he can't give the guy the smackdown - and I guess by the logic of Sunnydale you can't call the police and report a guy - who has been selling doctored beer to customers? Whatever. It's still funny to me.

And there's that little bit where Cave Buffy is on the bench sniffing at Willow and Willow is trying to lean away but isn't actually pushing Buffy away...time to do a rewatch.

but fails to make sense in such a way that the college girls (especially if they are insecure freshmen) worry that maybe it's them -- maybe it's over their heads -- maybe they're not smart enough for college.

OH GOD YES. And of course the girls who feel that way would be ones like myself, who already got that message from parents and other adults growing up "You're not feeling what you think you're feeling. It's ok for adults to treat you this way. You don't know your own mind, etc etc" So it's really a mindfuck,

It's interesting to compare this with the way Riley talks to Buffy in Doomed "You know what? You are stupid!" and how by the end of the episode she's kissing him and trying things his way. Either he was right (never mind that he was a total dick), or he's not but in Buffy's mind that's an ok way to talk to someone you claim to love. And if we remember Nightmares, Becoming and Dead Man's Party, it's no wonder.

If Buffy thinks that's an ok way for someone to court her, it's no wonder the poor girl is so messed up. So, there is always something in any episode that ties into the larger themes of the season and series.

Buffy represents a lot of girls that season whose confidence has waned since they were little girls, has been battered by internalized messages. Ironically, that's the point at which Willow's confidence is very much on the rise.
kikimay
Mar. 28th, 2014 02:36 pm (UTC)
Buffy represents a lot of girls that season whose confidence has waned since they were little girls, has been battered by internalized messages. Ironically, that's the point at which Willow's confidence is very much on the rise.

Nice point! To me it also explains why I relate with Buffy.

I have to rewatch Doomed. I like that episode and while I think that Riley is a little bit dickish I also believe that Buffy needed to see things in another prospective: she's not the tragedy of the whole male gender. She had bad luck but that doesn't mean a thing. Pity that the Briley break-up is again about her being the worst girlfriend. *sigh*
red_satin_doll
Mar. 28th, 2014 10:21 pm (UTC)
Nice point! To me it also explains why I relate with Buffy.

Willow was the character I related to most in the early seasons although I didn't LOVE her; then I fell for Buffy. the thing is, I related most to Buffy when she lost her confidence and less to Willow when she gained hers and that's really an uncomfortable thing for me to admit to and...what I do I with that information? IDK

I like that episode and while I think that Riley is a little bit dickish I also believe that Buffy needed to see things in another prospective:

You're being more generous to Riley than I am? WHOA. I can see what you're saying and maybe I need to watch that ep again but the thing that really stuck out for me was his "You know what? You are stupid!" Because....she had doubts about getting into a relationship with someone else?

Offering another perspective is one thing; being a patronizing asshat is something else. He claimed to know what she needed better than she knew herself even though he didn't even know her at all (and never really does IMO. He never truly understands her.)

And women have been encouraged to "submit" to the authority of male "experts" (the church, the medical profession, their fathers and husbands, the courts etc) and to trust the menfolk over their own intuition, intelligence and experiencs. Men have told our stories for us, have dictated what to do with our bodies. And that really grates and I don't have patience for that shit.
kikimay
Mar. 28th, 2014 10:35 pm (UTC)
I have this complex relationship with Willow because on the paper I should totally relate with her: I'm also the socially awkward nerdish girl. I also have control issues XD I should get her a lot - and rationally I do. Expect that emotionally I feel much more for Buffy. Maybe it's because

I related most to Buffy when she lost her confidence and less to Willow when she gained hers


That. It's a valid point and I agree. In fact I relate with late!Buffy.

About Riley in Doomed. Maybe I need to rewatch the episode - which, btw, SO FUNNY - I took the positive part of the message. Riley said something harsh, but I couldn't care less about him. My point is that Buffy really needed to see things from another prospective. She thought that relationships failed because of her and it's not like that. She's blaming herself for something that is beyond her control. And, even if things don't go well, it's not "the end of the world".

(I should write these exact words in my bedroom walls and read them everytime I freak out about stuff. Because I really relate with Buffy's insicurities)



red_satin_doll
Mar. 29th, 2014 12:52 am (UTC)
I have this complex relationship with Willow because on the paper I should totally relate with her: I'm also the socially awkward nerdish girl. I also have control issues XD I should get her a lot - and rationally I do. Expect that emotionally I feel much more for Buffy.

And that's me, exactly. I've done those silly which btvs character are you tests and I come up as Willow, and it's no surprise in some aspects. But I connect to buffy on a deeper level.

My best friend just started watching S1 and She LOVES Buffy. Loved her from WTTH, which was a lot faster than I was in love with Buffy.

Riley said something harsh, but I couldn't care less about him. My point is that Buffy really needed to see things from another prospective.

Agree to disagree here - she either will or she won't in her own time, but that's not the way to get through to someone. I'm not ok with him belittling her. She learned from her parents apparently that it's ok. It's no different to me than when you've talked about Xander belittling Anya - which he also learned from his parents. Same impulse, same pattern of male priviledge, ownership and patronization.

Edited at 2014-03-29 12:56 am (UTC)
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